Episode Transcript
Monica 00:00
So RJ, tell us a little bit about yourself and also how you got started. In the world of online advertising, I feel like I've watched your business grow over the years and evolve, thank goodness, because you're in a industry that does not stop evolving. But where did you start?
Well, I mean, so it really the entrepreneurial journey started when I started with the 5k races in Tampa, Florida. So just, can I make a buck on my own from, like, brand idea through execution? And my partner and I, Claire, you know, over 10 years, had probably close to 40 different 5k races, 1000s and 1000s of runners, you know, money donated to charity, and we could make a buck on our own and build something from the ground up. So that kind of kicked it off. And then I was always working in corporate marketing, doing some website stuff here, some social media stuff here, some email marketing here. And it was kind of inconsistent. It was all over the place. It was always on the side. And then made that leap in 2019 to full, full on business owner, yay.
And we do actually have an episode where I interviewed RJ years ago about his five Ks. And we did that so we could educate our nonprofit audience about ways that they could more effectively run their 5k fundraisers. So that's funny that it goes like
all the way and we go, we go, we go way back. You know, we've worked together MayeCreate, you know, they help us with our website and hosting, and you know, I went through your program. I don't know if you still offer that, but basically, do it yourself. Sort of, hey, we have all these cool things built in the back end of WordPress. You can use these assets, and we'll actually design your landing page for you or your homepage and get those other pages looking on brand. And you guys helped me so much
well, and you helped us in our journey too. Because for a while there, we really felt like we wanted to build our email list, and we were working on a different style of marketing, I would say, than we have transitioned to now, which is great, and you very successfully helped us run some campaigns. And I'm sure that you, I mean, part of it was because together, we honed in and we were like, This is what we can like, this is our expectation, and this is what we can get people to do with these ads, and then finding the right spot to run them and how to run them. Now that was your job, but you did a really good job with it. It was like, I don't even remember. You might remember, like, how much was it that we paid per email address? It was super low. It was like, $2.36
and the only reason I remember that is I still utilize that case study today in that you and MayeCreate had it awesome, right? You were a great client to work within that you knew your target audience, nonprofits, you created an epic lead magnet, which was the 10 social posts every event and fundraiser needs clear landing page, one offer, one message, easy form, easy deliverable. So you gave that target audience value what they actually need to be successful. They could download it easily, and then they got in your marketing funnel, and then you could slowly nurture them to one day, maybe they inquire about a website. It might not be that day after they got that free guide, but maybe you can nurture them and over the years, they know like and trust, may create design, and then maybe they will come to you for a quote,
yes, exactly. And you helped us with our what to put on your website.
There's a bunch of campaigns
really well too. It was just figuring out what people wanted. Because that one, interestingly enough, we had a down. We had, like, a downloadable resource that we were promoting, and then we retooled it and we named it something else, but it was basically the same information, just presented in a different way, and it did so much better the new way. And I was like, Oh, who knew?
I feel like you were just kind of ahead of the curve just thinking about your marketing and your lead gen efforts, and what that offer was like you were always testing, and that's what's so important about marketing, is you don't know what's going to work like until you launch it and start seeing some some results. But you would always, you would always be like, building out your campaigns and thinking about it and iterating like you didn't just sit back and get those $2.36 cent leads. You were like, Hey, what's this next campaign? Or what can we offer them to to get them to start building on them themselves, or come for us, come to us for like, a done for you situation.
Yeah, and the having you manage all the ads was just a huge stress lifted off of our plate, because you knew everything about the systems and how to set everything up. And while I could concept the creative and deliver it to you, I was not, I did not have any idea where to click or what to do with it, because it changes so fast, right? And I feel like now. I mean, all of the business owners that I talk to, they all talk about AI excessively and almost ad nauseum, and then it changes the way people search. And I just had people the other day at a trade show, they were like, hey, you know, with AI search, like, what do I need to do to show up in AI? And I was like, What do you sell? Do you have a blog now? Like, how old is your website? Because it is such a long game now, like, it used to be a long game. Now it's like, it's like an ultra marathon. It used to be a marathon. Now it's an ultra marathon to show up in some of these things, because there just isn't as much space for placement. And I find myself being like, I think you should find someone who can run ads. I've got this guy I know, because if you want movement now, that's it.
Like, I call it the light switch. You flip on the lights, you flip on the ads, you flip on, you know, the visibility, or turning on the faucet. You'll love you'll love this. So I'm driving my kids home from school last week. It's 430 got a kid in the back. She's like, yapping, crying. I get a phone call out of nowhere, and nine times out of 10, it's spam, right? I'm not answering. I got the kid in the back. I'm not gonna answer. But you know what? I'm like, I look at the number, I'm like, All right, I'm gonna answer it. I answer it. It's this incredible lead, all right, for my business, for HBT digital, but he found me on Google, Gemini on doing this AI chat, and I'm like, first of all, I am not optimizing for AI or this llms. I personally am not for my business. I'll be completely transparent. So it's still relevant to put information on your website, yeah, and your Google business profiles and your social medias, and be contributing meaningfully online, because people can still find you. And I was so surprised. He's like, I found you on Google Gemini. I'm like, what? Like a great lead, a great opportunity coming to me from Google Gemini,
I'm loading up my content pipeline, because I really think that our next episode, yes, AI search, and how it's changing website content, like what I'm seeing and how I'm changing the way that I put information on websites to go into AI and spoiler alert, it's like, if you did it right to start, it's probably still okay now, which is thank goodness, right? But on the other hand, I mean, if you didn't do it right to start, it's going to be a lot harder to show up in it now, because you've been judged, you know.
But also, I think it goes back to even like the landing pages. So nowadays I'm thinking so much about the landing page and not the total website, because that is a boost. That is the May creates of the world, but just the landing page in that you have to be so hyper specific about your audience and your offer and your testimonials. And I think when you dial it in so much that gives the AI and all these search engines that very specific thing. And I think that plays really well when people are doing their LLM searches, because it's hyper specific, hyper focused, and if your landing page matches that, it could be a really great and relevant return,
yeah, especially if you're using words that normal people use because you
were always great about that. Like, I forgot what your one if you think your website sucks, so does everybody else?
I have heard so many sales people be like, Oh God, my website sucks. Like, okay, let's see what we can do to tap into your boss. On that one,
it was just, you know, it was just clever. And I think we're going to be getting back to that in the world of AI, yes, it's a tool. Yes, it helps so much, but you got to iterate with your voice. You got to add personal anecdotes and stories. It can get you started. But that's what I loved, because you actually had a tone and a voice and so many corporate infrastructures and websites, even the small businesses, they have no voice, no tone, you don't know, even know on the about us, they don't even list the owner or the employees. It's just about the company we've been around 30 years, and nothing about the employees or the owner or or why you would want to connect with them.
I spend so much time because I use Claude to help me write so I can stay in like this big picture level. And then in the end, I do granularly edit and revise everything, but I spend so much time just responding. This sounds like every other company I've ever read about. I gave you all this information you even have. Like, when I interview people, I upload the conversation, like, the the transcription into Claude, and I'm like, read how these people talk. I want it to sound like that, but a little bit more polished. Like, go back, make it sound like them. I don't want to read like because I'm like, you're going to lose people in the first five seconds, and then Claude will come back, God bless him, and be like, you're right. This is very trite, and I'm like, you feel very validated right now. It's like he's trying to validate me as I'm editing stuff. But yeah, it just says the tone is important
just as we move forward. You know, I say we, but small business owners using AI. I think being real and showing up as your true authentic self, without all these edits, without all these like, special graphics, or without like, people knowing that is like an AI generated video, it's just gonna be so much more impactful.
Yeah, and not using click bait and grow stuff either in your ads, because it's and yeah, and I'm glad that you are getting into the backside of the ads too, because I feel like, I see a lot of people that run ads to sites, because I look at the data all the time, and I'll be like, Okay, you got them there and they did nothing. So that sucks, because it means you're sending them to the wrong page with the wrong method message. It's not congruent, and so it doesn't work for them. It doesn't convert, and that. And sometimes they want to blame me, but I don't run their ads, nor did I choose the page that the ad went to. I think I feel like it needs to be a dance between the web developer, the content developer, the marketer, the ads human, like all of them, need to work together to make sure that we're really talking to the audience about what they need to hear tell us about congruency. I just took us there go.
Well, yeah, no, I'm glad, because, you know, in Google ads, it's like, they call it quality score, but does the keyword match what's in the ad copy match what's in the landing page content? So that just gives your audience something to think about when they're creating their marketing campaigns or their ad strategy is like, one offer, one message, one landing page, because then once you understand what's working, what's not working, then you can iterate off of that. Like, like you do so well, I run into business owners, like, if I do an audit on their website or their ads, they just send to a contact page with just a form, no testimonial, no client logos, no additional selling points, no reason for differentiation. And I'm like, why would they contact you? Like, just because you have a form, just because you say free consultation, you wouldn't believe. Like, I just hate an offer that just says free consult. Okay, everyone offers that. It doesn't, yeah, it doesn't differentiate yourself. Like, how are you different? Why should I work with you?
Yeah, and please make that page mobile optimized.
Yeah, I don't want to see a website from 15 years ago.
Please do that. So you mentioned Google ads, and there's so many different ad channels now, can you give us a little rundown on what's working for, what for ad channels right now? Absolutely.
So you know, if you have something beautiful to display, image or or, you know, video, you know, meta is going to be the place. Demographics, interest, behaviors, um, with the tagging the audience control the speed of which it can perform. I just, I love meta ads, but Google is our bread and butter. Google is king. Google is, you know, your high search intent. So they go, they want an answer to a problem. You know, buy a Steelers shirt. Or why is MayeCreate design the best, you know, website maker in the land. You know, they go for a specific reason.
And do you okay? So meta, those are going to be more branding or early buying cycle ads, right?
I mean, not even not necessarily, because I love the remarketing ads. So if they like comment or engage on your content, or visit your your Facebook or Instagram, you can follow them so, like, if they have been to your website, you might as well give them a sick offer to try to convert them, right? Yeah. But you know, it can definitely play the awareness role, absolutely. And the reason why people would choose meta for awareness is the low CPMs, like I'm seeing cost per 1000 in the two to $4 range right now. So just for your audience to think about, to reach 1000 people of your target interests or demographic or behavior is $2 or $4 to reach 1000 people, that is nothing. So people need to understand, no one knows who you are in the grand scheme of things, in your small business, I'm sorry they don't. You have to advertise,
okay, so and then you can also help your conversions out on meta by, oh,
yeah, like, what I've been seeing really work really well. I was working with a financial services company. The on meta form is working really well. I like the conditional logic too, so you can filter out and qualify better. Meta is also really cool. So say you get a bunch of like leads that aren't qualified, or maybe they're spam, which happens you can actually mark those in their LEAD Center, and they will stop showing ads to people like that group. So if you have, if you have 100 customers, you can actually upload that list now, and they will try to find you more people that resemble the attributes of that audience. And then you can do look alikes on those so like a lookalike of my audience that actually buys from. Me, let's show them ads too. Let's give them a sick offer. So you need to be strategic about it. Thank God for AI. I mean, it helps so much. Like, I don't want to give all the secrets out, but it's all out there anyway. So here's the thing, you can just go to Claude and say, give me a Facebook ad strategy to sell my product service. But here's the thing, are they going to be able to be able to do it effectively? Are they going to know the nuances of the system? Are they going to be able to test and are they going to be on top of it while they're running their own small business and managing employees? So while they can do the research, they can understand, they can get a strategy. Are they going to be able to execute and are they going to be able to execute effectively?
Yeah, no. And I think that it's kind of like doing your own taxes, like, I don't really, oh, God, oh, that's exactly and so I think that you just have to know that you're going to spend money to make money, and even if you spend another, you know, 1000 plus dollars a month to have somebody manage it for you. You a, can't get an employee to do it for that amount of money, and B, that employee is never going to be as experienced as someone who does it every day, because they don't see the patterns of everyone else, right? So I think it's a tricky thing, because one of the things that makes me good at web design is I look at other people's stuff all the time, and I look at how it performs. I look at what Google, how Google's treating it, how like I look at it all every day, right? And how it's loading all of it. And so then, if you are just in charge of one tiny thing, how do you know like it's not I'm not saying you can't be good at it, but it's harder when your when your material to learn from is more, right? It's a tricky one,
but how I like to sell it to clients is like we try to give our clients a 3x return in their pipeline. So if they spend 3000 on ads, we try to deliver 9000 worth of opportunities in their pipeline. And now, if your product or service is five grand, 10 grand, 30 grand, 50 grand, you know, they just need one, a few opportunities to work, and then maybe one closes. So like we make it work for our clients, and that's why, you know, we've had some clients with us for about five years now. So it's just, like, just amazing, like, if you can show value, if you can provide those opportunities, because all small businesses need opportunities in revenue, that's it. All right, you can have the best marketing plan and strategy. If people aren't buying, if they're not converting, you're gonna be out of business. So luckily, you know, we're six and a half years in business. You know, you're you're what, close to how
long we're over 20. It's been a hot minute. That's awesome, but I do find, and this is where you know, you I feel like you can come in. Is that a website? It only lasts for so long before it just isn't going to optimize as well. And the way search changes and the way people search changes, and so it has to be tooled after years, you know. And I'm sure that ad strategies are no different, like they're going to work for a while and then they but they need to be babysat, and then they need to be adjusted so that they really do what they're supposed to do. Would you agree?
Oh, yeah. And especially if we, like, if we come out of the gate, we could have the best strategy in the world. But if we launch and you don't get any leads, or you get, like, a trick, like, the cost per lead is so expensive, then you're going to be out of a job. They're going to fire you, they're going to or they're, you know, completely retool their offer, their landing page and make adjustments. So, yeah, it just not all ads are successful. Not all campaigns are successful. It is a long game. Like you wouldn't believe how many things I've had to launch for my business in order to find something that worked and converted and made sense for my business. Like last year, we found it. It was the 34 ways to succeed with Google Ads guide, and we got leads on meta and our target audience for about $5.36 and then on step two of the funnel was a webinar conversion. So they would download this guide, and then we would try to get them in the webinar the following week about how to actively use the guide and be successful with Google ads. So now they got a valuable piece of content. Now they're sitting on a webinar with me. I'm discussing everything in the guide, how they can be successful, and then ways we can work together. And that worked really, really well. But to get to that campaign and that funnel and that system, it took years of like, trying different things and trying that system and trying, you know, you've been through it. It's just that's why people work with partners like MayeCreate design or HBT digital. Is because, like, we can execute, but we know what it takes to. Be successful, yeah.
And then, okay, so where did you run that at, by the way, meta Google ads, but on meta, yeah, and that, okay. And then the people often that I talk to that have a product or service that's, like, really obvious, like, I need a plumber, but I love to use plumbers as examples, because all the research that I've done in keywords and watching plumbers websites, people search for a plumber. They don't search for how do I fix my leaky toilet? They literally know the toilet is leaking and they need a plumber. It's like it.
I love working with HVAC companies. My best client is Chapman HVAC, who you introduced me to. Because when you're plumbing goes out, your heating goes out, your air conditioning fails at 95 degrees summers, that ad converts so well, and you can show like great performance. But like some clients are neat on a haystack. I'll give you one example. I was working with a company that did custom books for large companies that had a rich history 100 years and had board members that they would send these custom bound books to, and it was like finding a needle in a haystack of somebody searching for that specific thing, in that it was hard to be very successful on Google ads like, yes, like I said, sometimes you can have great success with like the HVAC companies of the world, because that's an easy conversion, or sometimes it's that needle in a haystack, and it's painful to find conversions.
But that, even that makes me feel like, Did you Did they did you? Did those ads go better? Or would they have went better if they were on like meta or LinkedIn, probably,
and we, we didn't get to test it. And that's the thing some people like, we try to be very clear, like, let's give it at minimum three months or six months depending, to see if we can figure it out. Like, you know, I had one client, you know, cancel after one month because he didn't, he didn't close any deals. We got him leads. It didn't close. So he's like, one month, you're not gonna learn anything. It's just, I don't know how he's working the pipeline. I didn't have full control of the CRM, the nurture, so that's kind of why we're kind of focusing our direction now on not just the ads, but what happens when that lead comes in to the pipeline? How often are you communicating? Are you emailing? Are you doing SMS? What other value are you giving them? Are you giving them other ways to book discovery calls like I'm trying to think about all of that, to really empower that business owner to convert better. That'll make our campaigns look better, that'll make the success more likely.
So we've talked a little bit about offers that work and offers that don't work, right? And it sounds like sometimes it's the network that they're on, because if they're in the right spot, like I wouldn't have ran a Google ad for what to put on your website, I guess I could have, but it was way cheaper to run it over in meta, right? And so, and in it, I think about those Google ads is like buying terms, right? So website design, Camdenton, Missouri, I read, I run, I run an ad on that, but it's going to be real expensive, right? So, but plumber, there you go, in Google ads. So it sounds like part of it is where you choose to run the ad, right? What are some other things that makes a great offer versus one that isn't a great offer?
Well, it should be for that specific audience. It should be time bound. You know her mosey says this, but if you need to make them feel like this pang of regret if they miss it, if they don't take if they don't jump at the offer. So that's how you need to be thinking about this. Is it such good value that if I don't take advantage right now, I'm just gonna feel devastated that I missed it. And we see this all the time with, like, you know, clothing discounts. I see it at least in my email, like, hey, we had the super exclusive 45% off this weekend only. You got to take advantage now. And it makes me want to buy, right? Because it's a limited time. It's that offer to me, great, outstanding offer. So you just need to be thinking about that for your business. And some businesses, it's easier said than done to create this offer, like, if you have this dry tax business, how do you create an outstanding offer? Yeah, it's going to be difficult, right? But I think if you depending on what you offer or what your services are, you can maybe think about cool ways to advertise that,
because it's not always about money, like it's easier with the with the clothing, because you're like, hey, everything's on sale. 75% off, and or I just drove past American Eagle jeans. Or 4999 well, they're normally 100 Okay. Well, that's a pretty great sale. But I feel like with our ads, when you were working with us, it was more about like, what? What is the piece of information that you really, really want? What do you really want to know? Because I'm going to give you a chunk of that if you download this thing and give me your email address, and it wasn't about money, because it was never. About money. It was always about, what do you need? What is the thing you really need that you think is going to tip the needle for you? And that was what we tried to make our offer.
And that goes back to the marketing channel. Is like, Google is pain. I have a pain for a plumber. I have pain for something meta, on the other hand, is like, they're they're passively scrolling right? They want to see updates from their niece and their kid, and now they see an ad for HBT digital. Like, it may not resonate, but that's why you have to be so specific about your audience and the messaging and the offer, and it can connect some some companies it doesn't make sense to advertise on Google, like, I'm a small business. I personally do not advertise my business on Google, because there's so much competition from marketing firms bidding on people that want to find Google Ads help or meta ads help it just it prices me out. So the place I can play is meta, but it depends on your product, your service, your your company. And that's why people work with like people like you or me, because like, we can steer them in the right direction and make every dollar matter. So like every dollar in a small business, every dollar matters. Like, I'm not going to recommend Google ads, if it just doesn't make sense for MayeCreate or for this other company
well and to your time matters. And so when you can get leads that are better nurtured, you have a better chance of closing that lead because they are more invested in you and know more about you, they probably already decided most of the time, like most of the time, they decided they're going to work with MayeCreate before we even answer the phone, which is great. And then there's other people who wanted their website done in three days and want to pay $25 for it. And so that doesn't really work. Sorry, you can't do that. But I think that you know, if you have a crap ton of leads, and they're not quality, and you're working them all, and then you're investing all this energy in it, then it's not really worth it. Like to me, as a person who has like time is a limiting factor of how much we can do,
and maybe we can as marketers better think of how we qualify in these prospects before they come into your system, before your sales team spends all this time and effort researching, calling, executing, to have them not buy. So like, what can you put on your form to or your landing page to qualify? So like, I have a new landing page for my company. It's growth, dot HBT digital.com, right at the top, the first hero I specifically put in small print. This service starts at $7,500 a month. So like right away, I'm trying to get out the tire kickers. Get out the people who won't even consider spending $7,500 a month on this full funnel marketing system. But then the people that it doesn't bother, people that actually see the value in it, they're going to keep reading, and now I'm going to qualify further on my form. I'm asking revenue, ad spend industry, and if everything makes sense for my business, and I know I can serve them properly, that's going to be even better when they come into my system.
Yes, on ours, it has budget which starts at our lowest budget point, right? It doesn't start at zero. And then it has industry, because that helps us. Then we also have have, like, have you worked with a professional designer before? Like, like, who built basically, like, who built your last website? Was it your dog? And those things help us a lot at to qualify our leads. Because oftentimes, if they've worked with a professional before, they are more likely to work with a professional again versus doing unless they, I mean, yeah, I'm gonna, I'm just gonna hold true with that statement. I want to, like, retool it and be like, well, there's a little bit, no, I think they're more likely to work with a professional again, especially if it's one that doesn't suck.
That's, well, it's like, do you want to remodel your bathroom? And you you can do it, but it's going to take you three months, and it's always going to be a disaster for those three to six months until it's actually finished. Or are you going to pay a contractor a hefty amount, but it's going to be done in three weeks, complete to your vision and executed perfectly. So what do you want?
Yeah, well, and the amount of money that you will spend in drywall repair because you did not do the plumbing correctly, that's all I have to say about that one or have something great, not that I've learned that from personal experience exactly. Oh, the misadventures of remodeling your own house. It's so fun. So a lot of our audience are construction companies, trades like trade, businesses like contractors, and we also have a lot of nonprofits, and a lot of them have never ran eggs before. So if someone has a modest budget, where do they start? And can they even, like move the needle on that? I mean,
so, so I, I like to advise people, if you. You're looking to get into ads, you should probably try to invest at minimum $50 a day. Okay, so that's 1500 a month. But I'm not saying you advertise all of your services, all of your products. Let's go all in on one product, one service, for that small amount. And usually you can move the needle, dependent, just depending. But if you have a smaller budget, that's one marketing channel, one service that you're promoting, one offer. All right, don't try to be fancy and be on Google meta, LinkedIn, on a small budget and advertise all of your services. It's gonna be a disaster.
I would agree with that, and it allows you to really hone in your messaging on that one thing to make sure you get it right, because you want to start simple and then move into complicated as you go. But two, I feel like every business has a gateway service. So for us, it's websites. We do websites super, super well. I would rather work on your website first, and then if you need somebody to help you with your trade show displays or with a banner or with a booklet or something like that. Okay, cool, but I would, but I want to go through the pain with you in your website, because I have such a good process that it's going to come out right, versus grinding through a brochure with you, and everyone feels like we're dying inside, a little bit like it can we just, I don't understand what it is like. But if you come in with a website, your brochure is going to be so much easier.
Oh yeah, because it's all, it's all there on the website.
So if you have a system, right, project, right? You have a
system, this person could try to figure it out, and they're probably going to jump on their flyer first, before the website, and that they're going to get so frustrated, they're going to quit, or they just come to you and get a website that's beautiful, it functions quickly, and then they can iterate.
Yeah, yeah. And I also think that the flyer versus the website, I have so much space and words that I can use on the website, and I should. And then when you get to this flyer, it's like, like, very tight. And so you're like, what's the most important thing? What do we say? What do we not say? I don't know. And it gets not as easy Anyway, okay, can I ask
you a question? Yeah, ask you a question. Where are websites going in 2026 like, what should we be thinking about you?
Well, we talked about it earlier, but I really think that you should be thinking about having, like, genuine content on each of your pages and genuine photos, and just differentiating yourself, because bot traffic is way up, 00, click searches are way up, so you have way less traffic on your website now than you've ever had before. So when you actually get a human, let's make sure that we're being humans and we can connect with them. Otherwise, you're just wasting, like you're wasting this opportunity. It just sucks. It's like, if you're at a trade show and you're just sitting behind your table and scrolling on your phone instead of trying to make eye contact with the people that are walking past and engaging them in conversation. That's like the difference between having that like human website that's engaging and making connections with people versus just scrolling on your phone and ignoring everyone. And that's what you're doing with your like crap website, right?
I love that example, because it's so true. Like, I've been to websites and heads down behind the desk, like, why would you engage or even look at this company?
I think the tech behind them is probably more important than ever in the structure, because there's a there are new laws and mandates coming out, like every day, literally in all different states, about how you need to do your work. I love that. I love having a governing body for web design because it makes them easier for everyone to use. And yeah, so you just have to be careful with it and knowledgeable, because it matters more than ever now, and it didn't matter as much any before. So, yeah, I think that's where they're going. It's great. I love it. Okay, so back to ads. There's this thing called the Google Ad grant for my nonprofit friends. Like, I know it. I know ish about it. Like, is it worth it? Like, what? Tell me about this?
No, no, it sucks. It sucks to get it. It sucks to try to use it. You're so limited on the type of campaign you can run. You can't run any display, you can't run any YouTube. Can't run performance Max, like it's just the controls on it. You know, if you get it and you can get it running and get impressions and clicks, more power to you. But it's so hard to be effective with it.
I feel like the type of nonprofit that I it would go well with is, let's say that you're one of your main money making vehicles for your nonprofit fundraising vehicles is like a like a thrift store or something like that. I think that could be. Turned into search ads, and it could potentially drive traffic for you. But if, yeah, I don't, I don't know for for the other ones, I'm like, Hey, I'm not sure, like, how you're doing this. I don't know where it's going to fall into place.
Like I secured a grant for one company a nonprofit. Literally, it would not spend, it wouldn't, it wouldn't activate. It's just, it's not, it's not great, in my opinion. But if you can get the money and it will spend for you more power too.
Yeah, well, and there are companies out there that they just work with Google Ad Grants, and maybe they like, know the insider armpit on exactly how to make it work, right?
Well, I mean, just so everyone's clear, they don't actually cut you a check for $10,000 they'll, they just don't charge you for the clicks. But good luck actually even approaching near of $10,000 spend, because it's not going to happen. A lot of it's broad match keyword based, which delivers crap traffic. So it's just like, not great.
Well, good to know. Okay, so let's say that I'm like, Okay, I want to run ads. Tell me what I need to have, like, what are the, what are the minimum things that I need to have to make these things work? Like, I'm the only
thing you got to make sure you do is put that pixel on your website from the market channel, and so put the meta pixel on your site, put the Google Pixel on your site. Now they're want to do what's called, like, why am I blanking on this now, but the conversion API so make sure that, if you're using like, WordPress, you have the plugin, you know, connected, and that's just going to make sure, like, the data is better on both channels. Get the pixel rolling, create your audiences, so people that you know have engaged with your site, your look alikes, custom audiences. And then make sure you have the offer, right? Make sure you have an engaging offer. What does your creative look like? All right, you need to test at minimum five pieces of creative You were always great at that. You always give me a folder of, like, 25 different assets, from the reels to the in feed all, like five different creative variations. You killed it. But that is also something, because ad fatigue is real. If you see the same ad multiple times, you're just going to tune it out.
Yeah, I'm a, I'm an ideas girl, so it's easy for me.
You have great ideas. It's like, boom, and you use props too, which is funny. I can't I just remember the props. I don't know. I don't have one. Do you have big scissors or something?
I have big scissors in one. All right, yeah, I have, was there a sword, a sword at a rainbow unicorn. I had a mug that says this could be vodka. That one got flagged after a while, though, okay,
but it was, but you were real, and people love that. So that's probably another reason why you had a $2.36 cent cost per lead. You know,
maybe so do you have to have a website? Like, I might be shooting myself in the face here, but it seems like there's a lot of small local businesses, especially in these small towns. They've gone word of mouth for a long time, especially in the service business, right? So they might be a roofer or an HVAC company. They really don't have a website.
I mean, on meta has that on meta form. So, like, they don't even have to leave meta, so they're contributing their lead information with a one click button submission on meta. Do I recommend it? No. I think you should definitely have a website. But do you 100% need it?
No. So there's probably pros and cons with using the on, use it on, click meta form. Yeah, so
there are pros and cons. Like, one Pro is the convenience, the ease, right? There's lack of drop off, because they can just stay on meta. They don't actually go to your website. And now, if you don't have a specific landing page, now they're clicking the about us and the blogs, and now they're super distracted, and now they don't even submit that form, whereas it on meta, it's just right there that ad. They click Submit. It's done. So but the ease, that's the problem too, is like, if it's so easy, maybe you're not qualifying them enough. You gotta, I think, put a little bit of pain in there to make sure they really want and need you. So I don't, I don't mind driving to websites, honestly, but,
but the meta can be well, and it sounds like, based on what you're saying, too. You could have them do the click on meta if it's if you're offering something, that you don't have to overly qualify, and then you can retarget them and then hopefully get them over to your website
for that's what's great about if you drive them to the website and you have your pixel, you can always retarget that website visitor. But also, if they're clicking on the ad in meta, they are engaging with the ad. So if you do remarketing on that, it hits them too. So but yeah, get a website. Get one for MayeCreate.
Well, do. Actually, I can't tell you how many people that I spoke to last week that don't have a website at my local Chamber of Commerce trade show. And I was like, so you don't have a website? Okay, I got that. And they're like, I do need one. And I'm like, Well, I like, Do you have a Google business, like, profile set up yet? And they're like, what's that? And I'm like, Okay, so here's the deal. Like, we can talk about your website, and we're going to, but right now, I want you tonight, after you put your kids to bed, to go set up your Google business profile, because you are, like, leaving so much money on the table by not having that thing set up. Like, it doesn't even make sense. And they're like, what does it do when I was like, Well, you know when people search and the map shows up and they're like, Yeah, and I'm like, and now all those businesses show up next to it. They're like, you can't show up there without one. They're like, how much does it cost? I was like, and they're like, I had at least four of those conversations because it's like, you do need a website. But there's also all these tiny other pieces out there that people just don't know about doing it so sad.
You know, we always think people know what we know and can do what we do, but like these small business owners, if they're, like, older, and I don't want to just pick on, like, older people, but like sometimes, if they're not as dialed in on the internet, you know the when you talk about AI, their eyes gloss over or chat bots on their home page when you know they don't really understand or grasp it. So, you know, it's an education thing with what we do, but you also have to really understand who you're trying to reach like so when, when someone goes to my growth dot HBT digital.com, website, we say you are in business for in you know, you're established, you have multiple employees, you have revenue over a million dollars, and you want to be able to grow, and you can support a lead gen effort and work those leads, like you have to have those five things if you're not ready to grow, or you can't work the leads, or, you know, you don't have decent enough revenue, it just doesn't make sense.
So it really doesn't so if Okay, so we're talking about ads. We're like, you're qualifying people right for the whole system that you can provide for them. And then if we take a step back and we look just at the ad component, like, how? How do you know if someone's not ready for ads at all? Like, they should just leave it alone,
if their budget is less than $1,500 a month, if their product or service, if they're selling a $5 necklace or $5 bracelet, it's going to be hard to deliver a great return on ad spend, because you're gonna have to get a zillion people buying this small items. So, like, you should want to price your product or service at a pretty high number. Honestly, that's just what I've found. If you're it's hard to make a good return when your product or service is like, tiny, yes, the value, the dollars you bring
in, and that's one of the challenges that we have with building websites for people too, is I can build a beautiful, custom website for your restaurant, but each thing that you sell is, you know, maybe $20 a plate. And so then
that, what kind of volume are you doing? Time
to build it back, right? And so for those people, they're like, they're crushing it out on Facebook in this community, right? Like, just keep up with Facebook. Put some, put your, put your freaking hours out on Google business, please. For the love of Pete, so that way people don't show up when you're not. There problems with working in a vacation community. But, yeah, I just don't know that they need to run ads. It's hard when it's $20
you know, if I was a small, small restaurant, right? If I had tiny revenue numbers, what I'm what I'm going to do is I'm going to run an awareness ad from like four o'clock until seven o'clock, put like $10 on it. And, you know, it doesn't even need to be a high dollar amount, but at least you're going to blast your area and you'll get some visibility. And now if you offer your happy hour special with 25 cent wings and $2 off beer, that is attractive. And now it hits right at the time, at four o'clock when they get off work, and now they're aware of it, that's going to be very meaningful, impactful,
and that would be really interesting look at to like, when people use social media during the day, because it could be that you need to run it on Friday, and it needs to start at like 11, because they're going on their lunch break. And during their lunch break, they look at social media, and then they're thinking about, what am I going to do tonight? And then it kind of hits them, and it works together that way. But I that's, that's great advice.
That's really if you have, also, if you have a small budget, here's what you should do. Find great partners like, you know, you've referred me business. I've given you introductions too. Just find somebody that you can work together with in partnership and share business referrals and try to try. To do that because spending ads, spending money on ads, is expensive. It's time consuming, it's hard, but it's worthwhile too. I mean, that's why people do it.
I had a client who earlier this year, no, it was mid last year. Anyway, she's like, I need more business. Blah, blah. And I'm like, Girl, you've been in business for like, 40 years. You have tons of people, why don't you pick up the phone and talk to the ones that are most like that are your favorites, and just that, just talk to them. Well, time for that. I need to have, like, lead, new leads coming in through my website. I'm like, if okay, but no, anyway, I think it fell on deaf ears during that conversation, right? But I and she, I was like, but this is how, this is how it works. Like, when we need business, we call the people that we know. That's what we do. That's how you get business, is by networking and talking to people. That's the easiest, lowest hanging fruit. And you can run ads and get the new people in. And depending upon what you do and and how much pain people are feeling, like the plumber, they need something fixed right now. Yes, the HVAC, it's out. They need it fixed right now. But the website is a it's, it's painful to you, but it's going to take a lot of work to get it fixed. And so you're think, oh, I should start on this, and then you're going to table it. I mean, like, Oh, I hate it so much. And much. And then you're going to table it, and you're going to do that over and over again for months, if not years, before it's just a complete dumpster fire, right? And then, and then you go get it fixed most of the time. That's how it works. And so depending upon your business like and what you sell, the ads can be a solution, but maybe you just need it. Like, if you're on a super low budget, just pick up the phone or send an email. Make the partner relationships like it'll yield you business faster, quite frankly, oh yeah, 100% so, RJ, anything else you want to tell people before we let them go today?
I just want to say, tell your friends and family you love them.
Ah, I hope you have a good day. I keep seeing that on the back I hope something good happens to you today. I keep seeing that on the back of cars. I love that sticker. I hope something good happens to you.
Oh, there's enough business for everybody. You know, you don't want to be greedy like just share, and we can always be successful.
Be thankful. Yeah. Okay, so if people want to find you and they want to learn more about all your services, where do they need to go?
Just the website that you helped me with, HBT digital.com my new growth website, if you want that full funnel experience is growth. Dot HBT digital.com and on socials. It's just at HBT digital consulting.
Thank you,
Monica, it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much. Anytime.
Monica 52:52
I'm sure you'll be back again, because I need to hear and everybody needs to hear what you've got to say.
